Powering up my Jukebox for the first time (Rockola 1458)

[johnlivo]

So, today for the first time after nearly three months of restoration work on my 1958 Rockola Jukebox (1458) I powered it up for the first time.


The good - There was no smoking, or sparks flying, no obvious concerns!  The lights all came on throughout the machine. The motor that turns the title strip barrel works, as do two of the buttons that control it! Some glitch with the third button for the title strip barrel, but other wise, when you push the Red Button, the title strip barrel rotates to the red section as it is supposed to. Same with the Yellow button and section of the Title strip barrel. This was really good to see, because I thought this system might be very problematic. 


When the control box switch is moved to the "scan" position the turntable begins to spin, and when I lightly touch the needle on the tone arm I can hear sound coming from the speakers telling me the amp may be working ok. 


When I drop a coin in, it moves through the slug rejector ok, and I think I can hear it register on the accumulator, but I cannot say for certain about that. 


But, that is about it, which concerns me and of course is rather disappointing.  I thought it would do a lot more at this point. 


The Bad - The main mechanisms are not moving at all. No activity from the gripper motor/gripper system, and connected toner arm, no movement at all of the record basket or carriage.  Whether in the Operation mode, or Scan mode, none of these things move at all. Not even a hum, or attempt to move at all. 


So, it looks like I have some major trouble shooting to do, but I really don't know where to begin, and would be open to any help and suggestions. 

Thank you all for any help you can offer!

John

[Ron Rich]

Hi John,
In your rebuilding-- did you check the fuses (or CB's) for correct size,type, and condition ? If not--that's first ! 2nd. Be sure all connectors are correctly inserted into their correct sockets. Did you check the operation of all mini-and other switches, and contact points on all relays (see our FAQ's section)? Ron Rich

[johnlivo]

Hi Ron

Thanks for basic check list.

Yes, I did check all fuses to make sure they were not only working, but the correct size.

I went through the whole machine and used paper and electronic cleaner to clean all of the contacts throughout the machine. And did that until the paper was clean.

I only found one bad micro switch, it was one of the three main ones that controls the timing of the whole Gripper system. But knowing how important those three main micro switches are I replaced all three to avoid problems in the future as well.

The thing is though, when I turn the machine on, and particularly when I move the control center handle to "Scan" I would expect the record magazine to at least attempt to move, but there is no movement at all, not even the smallest amount of movement from the Gripper or Record magazine in the slightest.

Although I did go through the whole machine and remove and replace all old capacitors, check all resistors, I did not check the transformers at all. And there is One big transformer in the Power Dist. Panel, and another two large Transformers in the amp that were not checked either.

The other main part of the jukebox that I did no improvements on is the Pin Bank. I went around and made sure all of the pins are loose and move freely, but I did nothing else to fix or improve anything on the Pin Bank.

I asked you about the Push Buttons, and you told me how to clean those up, but I have not done that yet.

At least some aspects of the Power Distribution Panel are working though, because all of the lights on the Jukebox are working. The Turntable spins when the Control Center switch is moved to SCAN. Also, the motor on the Title Strip barrel works and turns this when it's buttons are pushed. Also, when the Free Play button is pushed, I can hear credits being added to the Accumulator.

But anything to do with the Record Magazine, and Gripper system appear to be cold and dead. Never a sound or spark, or anything at all happening there. It's not like it tries to move, but is a little stuck, or doesn't move properly, and does something wrong, they are just completely silent and dead. Which makes me wonder if there might not be a problem with the Transformer on the Power Dist. Panel?

The two main motors, the Gripper Motor and Record Magazine motor were removed, and cleaned, and greased/lubed so that they turn freely again. Though I was not able to check if they actually work or not, I would think that at least one of them would.

Well, that is where things stand. Cosmetically, this Jukebox is done and looking pretty great if I do say so myself. The chrome pieces that I had work done on will come back to me early next week, so it sure would be great if I could get the mechanism running as well.

Please let me know what you think I should work or check first.

John

[Ron Rich]

John,
"Cleaning" relay (or any) contacts with "paper" and "electronic cleaner" is not satisfactory, IMHO--see our FAQ's section on contacts ! After a proper cleaning and adjustment check, follow the sequence of events that should happen to see where the system fails--then investigate that failure--- Ron Rich

[johnlivo]

Hi Ron,

Thanks again for the help. Yes, I did read the FAQs a number of times prior to cleaning the contacts, and I used CRC QD Electronic Cleaner which says it "Helps prevent Contact Failure, is Plastic Safe, and leaves no residue"

Is there a better product you would recommend? Also, I began conservatively spraying each contact, and then also spraying some on thick card stock paper and moving that through the contact to remove any contamination, and putting a little outside preasure if need be to remove as much as possible.

I didn't start off with any big guns like burnishing, because you said it removes the silver.

As far as checking for pits on the contact points, I wonder how in the world you can see such a small surface that is rather hidden, and all you can really see is the thin gap from the side??

I have a 1948 Seeburg Trashacan can that also has a lot of contacts on it, and I remember how the contacts would kind of flash and spark or buzz if they were off or dirty and such, well basically do something when they were getting a charge, but this Rockola at this point as I have described it is so dead and quiet.

I welcome your input and advice, and am glad to go over each contact again, and burnish or do whatever you would advise.

John

[johnlivo]

PS I know a guy here in Portland who is struggling with a 1961 Seeburg, so I introduced him to this forum. His name is Brent, perhaps he will join us here soon.

John

[Ron Rich]

John,
You gotta get you're eyeballs on the contact surfaces to see if they are pitted--You can also check them with the power OFF using a good analog meter as stated in the FAQs--
Have not seen "Brent"--yet ? Ron Rich

[johnlivo]

Hi Ron, and Jukebox addicts gang,

Well, I took a long break from working on my 1958 1458 Rockola, simply because I just wasn't sure what else to do to trouble shoot it.

I see your last recommendation to me Ron was to check all the contacts. I will start there.

I have a friend who professionaly repairs and restores radios and some record players, who is very knowledagle, but has never worked on Jukeboxes.

I will be giving him my manual to review, and then he will come over to do some trouble shooting on my machine for me. Great guy!

Do yo have any advice for me to pass on to him as far as what to check and look for?

Thank you as always!

John in Portland, OR

[Ron Rich]

Hi John,
Nothing to add at the moment-- hopefully your friend can help--- Ron Rich

[johnlivo]

Ok, thanks Ron!

John in Portland, OR