Brand new (to me) Rockola 464 with issue(s)

[ff214]

Hello all!  I am new to the Jukebox world...we just bought our first one.  As mentioned in the title, it's a Rockola 464.  It came loaded with records and was a decent price.  We could not get the top open when we were looking at it at the antique store so we were not sure what we were getting into.  I had been looking on Youtube at the likely issues it might have, however when we got it home and got the top open I found one I was not expecting-the needle arm is somehow in the "play" position but the record return arm is underneath the needle arm.  

I have no idea how to get the needle arm into its resting position and get the return arm back to the records.  I"m basically looking for a starting point to diagnose what exactly is wrong with this thing.  

I'm sure once I get this figured out, I will have to do the obligatory cleaning/degreasing.  I'm just looking for a starting point and some friendly advice.  

I cannot attach a picture because the forum has exceeded its attachment size limit.  Thank you in advance for any assistance that can be provided!

Mike

[Ron Rich]

Hi Mike,
Please, read the Hi Newbies post in our FAQ's section-- !
I think what you are saying is that the phono is in "play position, without having a record on the turn table (TT) ? If so, number one,
since the mechanism was not properly prepared for transport, I would suspect the TT has jumped out of the correct position. If you are lucky, you can turn on the phono (after looking for any damage), push the "reject button", and it will self correct the tone arm/gripper arm arrangement. Should it self correct-- stop the action as soon as the gripper is over the record basket, and reset the TT by lifting it, and pushing the idler wheel under it as it sits down. I assume you have read the above stickies --- Ron Rich

[ff214]

After some reverse engineering I have gotten all of the mechanisms cleaned, oiled, and working properly. After doing so it started attempting to play records. After clearing out all the previous selections I attempted to play a record, however when I push the third button for the selection, it attempts to read in and then stops. It will not clear until I turn the jukebox off.

As I said, after getting everything cleaned and lubricated, the needle swung over and it cycled a number of times. I've tried contact cleaner on all of the buttons, but I'm guessing it's an issue with the read in/write out?

[ff214]

More problem solving...I can manually flip the switch on the read in/write out wheel and it will pick the record up and play it. Still will not by utilizing the numbers. Also the record is playing slow. Also, it does not pick up to return. Still have som work to do...

[jukenorman]

Hi Mike,
Your statement "when I push the third button for the selection, it attempts to read in and then stops" is very vague! What should happen is that when the button is pressed for the third digit it should latch, the write-in motor runs, the write-in arm rotates and when the selection is made, the button should release.

The turntable running slow and the reject failing to operate are common problems, I'd be surprised if solutions couldn't be found in the stickies! You haven't said whether you got a service manual? I don't think you're very far away from a working jukebox!

Norman.

[ff214]

Thanks for your reply! I apologize that I am not very good at describing my issues. The speed issue is due to three grommets that are decomposed on the turntable. A piece of cardboard temporarily fixed it.

Regarding the button, the write in motor does not move. If I manually trip the switch for either a side A or side B selection then the arm rotates and the button released. I tried switching the read in and write out relays (they are identical I believe) which did nothing.

Funny thing is it actually worked properly for about a day then the issue with the button started. I think you are right, I am close! I do have the service manual I just struggle with figuring out how to diagnose the problem using it. Thanks again!

[jukenorman]

Page 25 of the manual - check the latch switch is clean and making good contact, this should enegise relay K7 which in turn energises the write-in relay K3.

Norman.

[Ron Rich]

Have you l@@ked at the WI motor-- Have you determined it's not "jammed" ? Have you properly oiled it ? Is the fly out clutch imbeded in the gears, or not ? Ron Rich

[ff214]

Update: I removed all the switches, cleaned all the contacts, and pulled the relays and cleaned all of their contact. Problem fixed with the third selection not working! I noticed a lot of static coming from the speakers so I purchased a cap kit and had the amplifier recapped. This made the static better.  However there is still static that seems to be much worse on both of the left side speakers. The static noise increases when you play a record-but not when you increase the volume.  For now I have moved the left wire to the right side terminal and switched it to mono.  I'm at a loss, I thought that recapping it would fix the static. Is this a transistor problem?

Also to help problem solve, the plug was missing the ground prong when I purchased this (removed by previous owner I guess?)  I don't know if part of the static could be a ground issue so I am going to go buy a new plug and install it and see if that helps.

Update to the update:  putting a new plug on made a difference.  There is very little static in mono with all speakers on the right terminals.  Still significant static when I put it back in stereo with the wires on the left and right terminals.

I'm hoping to have this finished for my wife by Christmas. Any suggestions? I'm nearing the end but want to get this thing sounding good for her. Thanks again for replying and helping out 

[jukenorman]

Very much a wild guess but the IC (RO Part 48934) in the pre-amp is known to sometimes go noisy. It can be replaced by a dual 741 op amp and it's socketed so it wouldn't be expensive or difficult to give it a try?

The PECs might also be a source of noise and an alternative strategy might be to swap the chips between channels one at a time to see whether the problem moves.

Norman.