VL 200 write in issue?

[prime]

Hi Marty and Norman i hope you will still help me with this. My electrical selector etc was removed to rechrome 6 of the pieces that house buttons and credit light etc. I worked on the box as you know to get a wall box to work, Unfortunately i didn't know the large metal box was a 5 uf cap, i found a broken wire and it caused all of my issues, i have now also replaced the cap with one fro VC. The wall box and VG app work flawlessly.  Unfortunately now after replacing the electrical selector i get scan only, i changed out the 2050 with the one i know works with the stepper, i changed out the 12AX7 and the two OA2 with ones from a working box, Ive looked for bad connection or loose wires, i tried battery trick and it selected all selections. Lastly i connected one end of my digital and analog multii meter to one side of the detent switch. i found a good ground for the other probe. With the analog it is difficult to see voltages but one thing for sure when the carriage scans to left i get fluctuation but not consistent numbers, when it scan to the right it just stays at one number. I cleaned the reverse switch no change. I readjusted the frog and now get fluctuation both left and right scan with carriage.  

[prime]

Readjusting the frog has got the detent switch working as it should i think, I get 293 vdc on each pulse each way while moving the carriage . Can this be the pulse amplifier, the cap has been changed but not all of the resistors.      

[jukeboxmarty]

So let me get this straight...

You can select from the wallbox and the VG app, but not the keyboard.

If that's correct, why do you suspect the read-out or trip circuits?

It sounds like you are again trying 'serial substitution' instead of troubleshooting!

[jukenorman]

Furthermore, the very first sentence of the battery trick sticky is "Performing the "Battery Trick", on a Tormat (TMU) equipped Seeburg allows one to determine if there is a read-out / sense/ (detent), problem. Once determined the read-out/sense is OK, one can address any write-in problems."

Did you clean the keyboard switches when the selector was removed? Is the trigger switch in the pricing unit clean?


Norman.

[prime]

Actually i did mention above i did the  battery trick ,it works perfect, stops at all selections. As far as credit unit , i have a free play from Victory Glass. The credit light is on and when i select the solenoid pulls in with letter pressed, releases when number pressed and starts scanning. One thing i notice is no buzzing sound coming from the solenoid when letter pressed. On my other box you can hear a slight buzz until number releases it. Before i reached out to you i read the sticky, did battery test ,checked connections ,cleaned keyboard , checked to see if the three latch bar switches where free and clean. Checked tubes and RCA wire, but understand if battery works it should not be tubes or pulse amplifier. I was wrong with the buzz, it is so slight you need to lean in to hear it. 

[prime]

Feb 13, 2024 3:06:07 GMT jukeboxmarty said:

So let me get this straight...

You can select from the wallbox and the VG app, but not the keyboard.

If that's correct, why do you suspect the read-out or trip circuits?

It sounds like you are again trying 'serial substitution' instead of troubleshooting!

Im actually trying to troubleshoot, im following suggestions in the service and trouble shoot manual.  

[jukenorman]

It was precisely because you said that you did the battery trick that I quoted from it - do I need to do it again lol? Did you clean the switches? Can you make no selections at all? I'm trying to think if anything in the stepper would hold out the keyboard selector.

Norman.

[prime]

I had previously washed the keyboard, i just removed it and cleaned again with diluted degreaser and warm water, in the process of drying now. Ive tried at least 30 selections and none have worked, i could try them all. Is there any tests for keyboard to confirm its sending a signal. Its funny when you read the sticky from Ron he mentions the trick then never mentions it again in the post

[prime]

Hi Marty and Norman, I know this is not the way to troubleshoot but i installed the keyboard and the free play on to my 161. Worked as it should.

[jukenorman]

On the contrary, that's a perfectly acceptable way to troubleshoot because it effectively eliminates the keyboard switches. Looks like something in the stepper is holding out the keyboard - time to get the schematics out!

Norman.

[prime]

I thought the stepper had nothing to do with the keyboard?

[jukenorman]

Except that they are both writing to the same tormat! And I also only said that it should be checked.

Norman.

[prime]

I cant follow the schematics as well as You and Marty can so i just want to confirm that this could not be an issue, I changed the 100 ohm resistor on the 2050 tube socket and the C23 5000 MMF 1000 vlt with a 005.6 uf 1600vlt because i didnt have a 005. The resister i tested and its still 100ohm but the 5.6 I hope can not cause this issue. pete

[jukenorman]

There's a contact on the number stepper that opens when it's operating and stops the keyboard making a selection, What should happen is that the keyboard buttons should stay latched until the stepper has completed, the contact is in series with the start switches. So check the contacts that close when the numbrer stepper resets. This is complicated somewhat by the VG credit unit that I don't know exactly how it operates and whether it releases the latch solenoid on a short timer (I suspect it will).

Norman.

[prime]

When using the keyboard only the play control relay moves, nothing else in the stepper