Prestigue es 160 blows Si 1 fuse

[chris1974]

As soon as power up the jukebox fuse Si1 blows.  Does anybody know what circuit this protects.

I had rebuilt the carriage, so I thought this was the problem.  I unplugged the carriage, replaced the fuse and powered it up and fuse still blows.  The carriage wouldn't play both sides of records only one side and it worked fine.  that is why I chose to rebuild it.  Before that everything else worked.    Any help here would be appreciated I am not sure where to look.  The only thing that changed was the carriage.  When i manual spin the carriage motor everything seems to move.

Thanks 
Chris

[Hildegard]

Fuse Si 1 in ES (and ESII) is for the 43V line.
If I understand the schematic right rectifier B80 C3200/2200 is in this 43V circuit too. Maybe that one is troublesome?

Hildegard

P.S. Model "Prestige ES 160" stated on the ID plate can mean having this model with either ES or ES II technical equipment.
From the outside it can't be said.
While ES uses a 4A fuse for Si1, it is a 5A in ES II. Means it can be needed to know for which ES version help is asked for.

[chris1974]

Thanks for the information

One issue might be that I had ordered slow blow fuses, they look like like normal fuses.  They are just stamped 5 amps.  It'll be a few days before I can get the proper fuses.
Although I did try a regular 6 amp fuse and it blew also.

[chris1974]

Another question I have.  Could I have damaged the board after I rebuilt the carriage?  The juke box worked ok before but would only play one side of a record.  I do get 43 volts at the fuse holder.  

[Hildegard]

Hi Chris,

Firstly, it would be helpful if you add your location (country) to your signature. Click on "Profile" - "Edit Profile" - "Personal Information" and then add to "Signature". This helps to know if we talk about 50 or 60 Hz.

If you are in a 60 Hz. country, then 5A slo blo is right. NEVER use a higher rated fuse, it might cause further damage.

I am not a technician, no real techncial beackground which means I cannot answer technical question well.
Do you mean the little board at the carriage with light barrier cradle block and transistors T102, 103 and 104?
If so I'd say we're talking about 1982 ES II technology.

Fuse Si 1 is for the 43V circuit. They supply the carriage motor. With the rectifier and some diodes 56V are craeted which is needed for some relays.

From this I'd say check the motor and realys, if by any chance one contact is not open or closed right, if 56V gets created.

Maybe the description from the manual helps and the excerpt from the operating scheme.

Hildegard

[chris1974]

Thank you for reply.  I added my country to profile  I live in Canada.
When I bought the jukebox it came with another,  I thought I could get one working from both.  I switched out the electrical center, powered up no fuse blows.  When I went to reinstall the carriage, I had it out to look it over for problems.  The record transfer arm is in the up position.  I set in bottom of jukebox, hoping it would correct itself.  Powered up and  the turntable motor stays running. I can manually activate the reverse switch and it changed direction and the carriage motor stops when end switch is activated.   The record arm stays up.  So I'm guessing I didn't put the carriage back together properly and fried the original board and the spare board was already no good.   I don't understand why turntable motor would be activated.

The only problem I had with this juke box was it would only play one side of the records.  It reversed directions but the tone arm didn't move over.  

[jukenorman]

Hi Chris,
I'm not long home from a trip to Canada although I kept quiet about it in case I got hunted down by our Canadian friend Prime (only joking!)!

If the record transfer arm is in the up position, the turntable will spin. The turntable motor is initiated by the scan relay but the motor doesn't engage with the turntable until the record is in position when it is mechanically released to engage with the turntable rubber tyre. You should be able to return the transfer arm by operating either the record or manual reject switch which should energise the motor operate relay. Alternatively you can manually operate the motor coupling with your finger to drive the transfer arm back.

The tone arm not moving across to play the other side of a record is usually caused by lack of lubrication, it is purely a mechanical action.


Norman.

[chris1974]

The carriage is installed and moves correctly.  When powered it travels to left, then right and stops at home position and everything stops as it should.  When i select a record the carriage travels to the correct spot,  Picks up record, it doesn't load record all the way, turntable starts, carriage motor stops.  When i press the reject button record loads the rest off way, tone arm wont travel along the record.  Pressing the reject button a second time the record unloads back to the rack and the carriage  travel home and everything stops.  It appears the record transfer arm is not traveling all the way up.  What would cause the loading procedure to stop early?

[jukenorman]

It sounds as if you're very nearly there! I thought that I recalled a similar problem cropping up previously - in this thread:
jukeboxaddicts.proboards.com/thread/4040/nsm-carriage-play-sides?page=2

Having read through the thread, I'm not sure whether the issue is quite the same as yours? But I think it's worth you going through it anyway because there are similarities that might move you along. Let us know if it helps at all - otherwise we'll have to scratch our heads some more!


Norman.

[chris1974]

Thanks everyone for the replies, I checked out that link, I just had to adjust the operating switch.  Records load and unload properly.  
The tone arm wont move correctly and play the records  The arm hits the middle of record doesn't pick a side.  I've adjusted the pressure springs.  It seems that the spring on ride is too tight, which I think is weird springs don't shrink.  
Step by step Ill get it working like brand new.  I hope!

[jukenorman]

Some progress then. You might find it easier to deal with the tone arm issues on the bench. If you remove the mechanism motor and coupling, it's nice and easy to drive the mechanism manually - activate the trip solenoid and drive the mechanism with your finger until the point where the operating switch comes in. You should be able to see if anything is jamming the tone arm. The tone arm should easily move in and out in neutral balance (there is a counterweight) and side to side (one of the springs should pull it in towards the record). If you then continue to wind the mechanism, the transfer arm should return to the scan position and the solenoid resets.

If you then activate the solenoid but wind the mechanism in the opposite direction, it should load the record and the tone arm moves across - you should be able to see the "finger" that operates it. Again, something could be jamming it but NSM mechanisms are fairly delicate and I think every time I've come acroos that issue, it's been down to lack of proper lubrication.

Best of luck, Norman.