NSM CITY (ES)II (Shure Cartridge) Picks Wrong Selection,

[fab4gear]

Hi

Fixed quite a few NSM Boxes in my time amongst other makes, for myself & other peeps (75 years old next week!!!)

But after about 20 odd or more hours spent on and off with this one over the last month, I have a bit of a dilemma!

Customer moved it downstairs from sons bedroom to take it to his new flat. Chariot (Carriage) fell off the rail &

after replacing it & booting it up in it's new location it played wonderfully in every way, EXCEPT it will only play 45's, 12 positions away to the left

IE input 120 & it plays 108, input 130 & it plays 118. but put in 110 & it just keeps scanning.

Scan looks right in the display & shows the correct selection when the Chariot stops in the wrong place.

Checked all the usual suspects BS & End Switches, Opto's, Relays  & other components on all the circuit boards etc, but had no joy.

I have the full 96 page service manual & all the NAFF out of focus schematics including mistakes), which are a bit confusing & vague to say the least!

Do any of you more knowledgable good folk in here have any ideas??

Regards Paul

(complete with numerous lumps on my head after standing up when the lid is up and hitting it on a sharp corner!)

[jukenorman]

Hi Paul,
Despite you checking it, I think your problem is almost certainly the end switch or something associated with it. Maybe you know that when it is initiated it provides the reference for the opto to count from. The end switch is normally open and provides a ground to the control unit at connector 10-07 when it closes at the right hand end. I think the switch must be sticking somehow and by the time it returns to the normally open state, the carriage has run tweleve slots to the left - something along these lines anyway!

Norman.

[fab4gear]

OK Norman. Thank You kindly mate.
I will indeed check it again tonight.
I'll let you know.
cheers
Very Best Regards Paul

[fab4gear]

Well Norman, yesterday I spent a couple of hours messing about with the End Switch (even changed it for a known good spare that I had) & checked out all the associated connections from the Chariot Circuit Board to the Central Unit & from there to the Credit Control Unit, but no change at all.
Adjustment of the End Switch does slightly change the stopping position but only by about one position. However, I did notice something else, the display does run thru the scan sequence when the chariot moves & shows the correct digits for the selected 45 when it stops. BUT (unlike what I stated in my first comment) the scan read out starts at 189 (NOT 179) & ends at 110, so this must be why it's missing the correct 45 by 10 or 12 places. I hope it's a programming problem & not a fault on the Credit Control Board which is expensive to get repaired, altho if it's an IC or a component I could probably replace it myself if I can suss which one controls the read out, as I have some decent soldering equipment. Sodds Law it'll be the CPU!!!
Any further help would be fantastic please.
Regards Paul

[jukenorman]

Yes it must be a programming issue, see C9 below - hope it's readable!

Norman

[fab4gear]

Norman. Thank You so much for the help. The information above worked fine style & you saved me a lot of time by pinpointing the exact part of the program that I needed.
I can get the box back to the customer now after a month, it never occurred to me until a couple of days ago that it could be a programming issue, as I was focused on any damage caused to
the chariot & it's connections to the other boards after She switched it on before realising (when it didn't work) that it had fell off the rails while in transit to her sons house.
I've definitely lost money fixing this one and would have had to spend even more time on it if it had not been for you.
Thank You once again Sir.
Regards Paul

PS. My NSM ESII 90 odd page service manual which I bought from Sound Leisure in Leeds donkeys years ago, looks totally different to that page that you showed above?
I think these NSM manuals and schematics are probably the worst I have ever worked with over all the years on various different machines. Really confusing, vague, misleading &
even wrong in places. Trying to suss which circuit board houses a certain part of the whole system is a bit of a nightmare or maybe I'm just a thick Geordie!!!

[jukenorman]

Hi Paul,
Glad you got it fixed - all part of the learning curve! I have a mish mash of NSM documentation and I have no idea where the part that I scanned came from. I agree that NSM documentation can be a nightmare! But if you are ever stuck especially for correct schematics, the folks at jukebox-world.de will sort you out no problem. Hildegard is a member here and is very helpful, check out the thread further down on Jonas' City II.

Norman

[fab4gear]

Thanks Norman your an absolute star mate!

[fab4gear]

Confessions Of A Jukebox Mender!!!

I think this machine must be Jinxed LOL!

After trying it out for 3 hours at home yesterday, I took it to the customers house this morning full of confidence that it was 100% working.
Untied the Chariot, which I had cabled tied to the rail to stop it moving & reinstallled all her 45's.
Selected a 45 the Chariot came over loaded the record & immediately put it back again, tried another 3 but same again so it was back to that right pig of a BS operating switch,
which I had to fiddle about with for 20 mins until I got it right again & it all worked.
I had even put locktight on the screw head the night before & it still manage to dislodge itself in transit!!!
Don't think the woman was too impressed to be honest, it's only about the third time in 35 odd years that I've had an ordeal like that!!!!
I'm sure some of these machines are really aliens from the Planet Zanussi!!!

[jukenorman]

There have been a few times when a troublesome NSM has prompted me to utter "never again!" but the threat has never been carried out. I'm waiting on an Ortofon City II coming in for repair but we've met before so hopefully won't be an ordeal!

Norman.

[fab4gear]

Norman
I love the look of the Ortofon cartridge  (little black snake) really modern and sleek, but my favourite is the style of the Cobra arm on my 1948 Wurlitzer 1100.
Paul