SHP Amp Replacement

[paradisecs]

I recently ordered a replacement SHP amp for a SPS160 that I picked up minus an amp.  What I got is different that any SHP I've looked at.  The easiest way to describe it is by picture but it doesn't have the two smaller transformers and only has connections for 1 pair of 50 watt speakers.  What could this have been for and is it usable?

[Ron Rich]

This was a failed attempt to cut costs--all were (supposed to be) re-called ! I sat for hours, modifying these to add the two out-put transformers, and CV/DEC terminals that are missing here--did not know ANY, ever got out into the field. I would send it back ! Ron Rich

[robnyc]

"paradisecs" I had seen one of those in a machine in an op's shop on Tenth ave. My friend Bill lamented "look at what they've done now -utter garbage". Op's also hated the later plastic RVC motors because parts sometimes fell out.

That amp is fine if you are not interested in external speakers. Or, you can get a Rowe transformer pack and connect that. The 50 watt is more than adequate....Or you can sell it. 

RobNYC

[Ron Rich]

Rob.
I agree with your friend, but I wonder where the "boys" at his distributorship were--they were NOT to sell any of them that were not modified ! ?? Seeburg devised a "bolt on kit" to add onto the amp--about a 15 minute job. We never used the kit--just added the parts
As for the Plastic motors--no "plastic motors" were ever used, to my knowledge--those with the new plastic housing, had GE "metal motors" ? They IMHO, were one heck of an improvement--(till they "improved" them again) -- modified the clutch with metal 3 balls--which did fall out (drilling a small hole thru the plastic, and JB welding them in place, fixed that problem) ! Ron Rich

[robnyc]

May 16, 2018 2:39:24 GMT Ron Rich said:

Rob.
I agree with your friend, but I wonder where the "boys" at his distributorship were--they were NOT to sell any of them that were not modified ! ?? Seeburg devised a "bolt on kit" to add onto the amp--about a 15 minute job. We never used the kit--just added the parts
As for the Plastic motors--no "plastic motors" were ever used, to my knowledge--those with the new plastic housing, had GE "metal motors" ? They IMHO, were one heck of an improvement--(till they "improved" them again) -- modified the clutch with metal 3 balls--which did fall out (drilling a small hole thru the plastic, and JB welding them in place, fixed that problem) ! Ron Rich

The Seeburg distributors in this vicinity were Al Simon Co and Atlantic in Brooklyn. The amp I mentioned was in one of the mid-70's models that came in for service.

I didn't think much of it because I had a U-100 with original amp and separate tran pack. I just figured this was an option -till told otherwise.

Yeah, the motors & pots were not plastic, but everything else was. I didn't think there was anything terrible about it, but got an earful when I mentioned it. The older types that I still use have a plastic gearbox.

The issue that I had was "why" . Seeburg had the best mechanism and selection system in the industry so, why were they always gyrating in/out of insolvency and cheapening their products.   I can say without question that this was the major reason why Rowe machines began taking over here in town even before Seeburg finally went under.

FWIW: In June 1986 you could still buy a new SHP3 from Simon's for about "two bills" as I was told. they gave it to you in a plain cardboard box that looked reused. I picked one up for a 201 we were converting to stereo and getting ready for a location.  I don't know if these amps came from machines that never got built..or  warranty stock. The transaction did have a somewhat clandestine feel to it.

Rob

[paradisecs]

How would I wire the speakers? Where do the yellow and green wires go?

[robnyc]

Red and blue wires go to each "50" and the black to either "Gd".

Yellow and green are for consolettes and not used. Tag them out of the way.

If this is the first time for powering the amp I suggest a 40 watt bulb in series with the amp power plug. It should flash bright and lower to a dim glow.

RobNYC

RobNYC-

[robnyc]

"paradisecs" I just downloaded the pic and see what appears to be an Albert Simon service sticker. Is anything written on it? If so it was worked on by one of the people I knew. Not important -just sentimental interest.

Rob

[Ron Rich]

Hi Rob,
A "lot of stuff" went out the "rear/side doors" at Seeburg-- I never knew amps did, but anythings possible !
The SHP 3 Code C has the thirmister under the heat sink-- not sure about the SHP-2's. All other SHP's originally had the transistor bias circuit.
Was your "U100 a "U-100D" or not. I thought I saw a TSU-2 with-out a transformer in it, but I know I have seen them with transformers installed--
Ron Rich

[robnyc]

Ron, the U100 had the "Discotheque" scene installed over the original. There were two fluorescent tubes one was 20w black. They were on a double-throw toggle in a recess at back that said (IRRC) Discotheque and normal. The grills had been pained the same blue as used in the LS3 and had the two dancers emblem on front. Amp was unpainted w/separate tran for 70V.

If any reader has this particular machine and wonders what the tiny toggle switch near the front of the amp is for, I added that to change the AGC time constant. There is also a patch on the tonearm cable where a mouse had chewed through and killed one channel. I paid $50 at Simon's -so no complaints.

One thing that struck me about the whole juke business was the sort of "anything goes" as long as someone gets paid something. I was told of jukeboxes being "borrowed" right from the loading dock at Rowe's NJ outlet.

If you wanted to buy a used machine one just stood in the line at Simon's parts counter and asked aloud if anyone had machines to sell. I always found something of interest there.

To get the amp at Simon's I went through the loading door on 43rd street off Tenth and up to the large service dept on the second floor. I knew the people there and thus didn't need to wait in line for things at the parts counter in the storefront on Tenth ave. They had been Rock-Ola reps till sometime in the mid-sixties when they expanded by stringing together several old commercial buildings on the avenue and side street. They went to Seeburg in/around 1966. It was quite a facility -dingy and very old school. It was sold & closed in late 1988. I guess all the service bay test racks on the second floor came down with the buildings. Too bad. I should have taken time to shoot pic's in there.

Rob

[paradisecs]

Thanks for the info. I built me a dim bulb tester so all good there. I always assumed the yellow/green were the cone speaker hookups and never realized that all four speakers ran off of the red/blue. Every blackbox Seeburg I've looked at so far has been hooked to the 16 watt posts. What does hooking to the 50 watt do differently and is it safe to run all of them that way? 50 watt if stand alone and drop it down if you are adding speakers?

The vendor found the module with the transformers and connectors and is sending it to me.

[robnyc]

"50 watt if stand alone and drop it down if you are adding speakers?"

Correct.

Good luck.

Rob

[Ron Rich]

Gents,
Nope --On the SHP-1 & 3amps you can run up to 100 watts on each channel-- no need to drop the cabinet speakers down, in most cases. Ron Rich

[Ron Rich]

Rob,
On the "U-100"-- what you had was the 2nd version--If not marked on the ID tag, it shouldda outta been ( but you know those lazy, "right coast" distributors) been as a "D", it was "kitted" to a "D"(isco). The U-100 "Mustang" was sold as the 1964 model. The U-100D Discotheque Jr., was the 1965 model. ( Sales of the Mustang were less then spectacular, and a kit for all in stock "Mustangs" was available free, to all distribs--I installed a number of them. )Ron Rich