M100B mech stuck on selection

[phillg]

Don't ask why, I seem to have picked up some sort of jukebox-collecting bug, but I've bought a Seeburg M100-B. It's complete from what I can see (even if it has a terrible paint job) but I've come across the first issue.

The machine turns on fine and I can make a selection. When I do, there's a satisfying 'clunk'... but nothing happens. Then, I realized that the mech isn't sitting in it's resting position on the right, instead it's stuck on J5. The machine isn't trying to actually play the record - it's just sitting there.

Any ideas on where to start?

Thanks!

[Ron Rich]

Phil,
Yep--"--da manuals---" -- I suggest that you purchase the manuals from one of the suppliers listed on our FAQ's page, and if un-fimiliar with the basic Seeburg Mechanism, you also purchase the "Seeburg Mechanism Guide" from me, ([e-mail]) that I wrote.
Meanwhile--check that the Service Switch is in the operate position-- Ron Rich

[phillg]

Manual is already in the post. Thanks for the mech book, will get that ordered too.

[phillg]

I've checked the two switches. The Service switch was set to the off position, but turning it on has made no difference. I tried the scan switch too-- it also didn't move the mech. I've checked the fuses and they're all fine. The remote is a bit battered and the pins on the cancel switch were bent and touching, so I've unplugged the remote and plugged the dummy plug back in (which thankfully came with the machine). I can hear the speaker humming at high volume so I know the amp is working fine and, assuming it has to be unmuted by the mech (no manual yet) then that's working.

I'll give all the plugs a wiggle and make sure they're seated properly, but can you think of any other basic troubleshooting steps you can recommend while the manual is in the post?

EDIT-- Just to add, I've checked the selector mechanism, it's moving the pins correctly, so thankfully that's one part I don't need to worry about. Just need to work out why the mechanism isn't scanning.

[Ron Rich]

Hi Phil,
Quick--simplified version of motor control-- on that model
AC to motor controlled by "play control relay", in the WSR--closed contacts supply 1/2 of the 117 AC thru the reversing switch, to the motor run cap, and the motor. Play control relay energized THRU service switches, via either/both, the switch assembly, or thru the SA unit (single wire broken out of the harness, connected between the SAU and ES). Check to see if the relay is energized -- or not-- Ron Rich

[Ron Rich]

Phil,
Another "quick thought"--check the mechanism plug--these are "famous" for loosing their index pin !!
Ron Rich

[phillg]

Thanks for the pointers Ron, I really appreciate it.

Just checked, the play control solenoid is activating properly as soon as the machine is powered up.

I checked the mech plug too - the index is there and the plug hadn't been jammed in. Next I'll have to get out a meter and follow the power to the motor in the mech. Hopefully the motor isn't broken!

[Ron Rich]

Phil,
Spin the motor coupler with your finger--power off, and power on--any difference ?

[phillg]

How stiff should it be? I found a pin punch small enough to fit inside the Allen key (don't have an Allen key small enough). At first, it wouldn't budge. I can now move it, but it's far from "free".

I wonder if the mech is all gummed up. I stuck the pin punch in there while the machine was on and I could feel a small vibration-- I guess that's the motor trying to turn so I powered the machine back off! Don't want to burn out the motor.

[Ron Rich]

Phil,
Iffin it won't move by turning the motor coupler--you gottta a real gummed up mechanism, or a foreign object jammed UNDER the Plastic (or fiber) main gear. See my suggestions for washing that mech in my "Seeburg Mechanism Guide". You probably won't burn out that motor--which brand motor is in it--has it been PROPERLY, oiled--one of the brands they used in them tended to freeze if the upper main bearing was not oiled-- Ron Rich

[phillg]

I've only just got the machine, so I don't know how well oiled it is. I'm guessing either not at all, or not with the correct oils/lubricants. I guess I'll need to clean it out completely. My plan was to remove the mech anyway-- but until I can get the mech moving I can't remove 50% of the records as the mech is in front of the slots.

I've bought your book online but it won't arrive until Monday or Tuesday-- I'm away on vacation for two weeks on Monday so I guess I'll just have to pause for a few weeks. I have a lot of sanding/stripping of old paint to do so that will keep me busy in the meantime.

Still, if the book turns up before I leave I'll have some very interesting vacation reading!

[Ron Rich]

OK--thanks for the purchase--don't know why youz guys buy it on line--cheaper and faster, directly from me--see you when you get back from vacation-- Ron Rich

[phillg]

*Note to self* read stickies more carefully

Have cancelled my online order, will ping you an email in a moment.

[phillg]

I've got the mech lubricated nicely (needs a good clean but it's moving for now). It's encouraging to see movement but of course there's now a new problem.

The turntable spins, the lift arm picks up the record (or not, because it's sitting in a position where no record is inserted) but as soon as the arm moves into the play position, the mech immediately rejects the record. Then, without scanning, it immediately picks up the record and the process repeats. The only way to stop it is powering off the machine or flipping the maintenance mode switch.

My first thought was that the clutch was jammed into the play position, but I've lubricated it well like the rest of the mech and from what I can see it's not even getting engaged.

Any suggestions?

[Ron Rich]

Hi Phill,
Didja READ the mech guide you picked up yesterday ?? It explains that in the Sequence of operation section, of the "Pinbank' phonos. Several factors can cause this including the most common one of not properly locking the mechanism down, PROPERLY, prior to transporting it Check that the contact block that rides under the SAU is properly held in place by it's "U" shaped bracket. Ron Rich