Seeburg SC Wallbox

[sooner]

Feb 20, 2019 3:58:13 GMT Ron Rich said:

Rob,
LOL--The "white button" SC's were made in late 1961/early 1962 --- thatz over 55 years ago !! --and their still running !!
Steve I would NOT use "lithium grease"--see the FAQs on lubes-- Ron Rich

Unfortunately I did read the FAQ on lubes.    How's that for bad memory...  

[Ron Rich]

Oiling an "electro magnet" ?? No reason I know of to do that--don't know what "electro magnet" you are speaking of, but I think I would remove that oil ?? Ron Rich

[sooner]

Feb 20, 2019 4:08:41 GMT Ron Rich said:

Oiling an "electro magnet" ?? No reason I know of to do that--don't know what "electro magnet" you are speaking of, but I think I would remove that oil ?? Ron Rich

 I didn't oil it the electromagnet. I'm not that dumb!    It just started buzzing after I oiled the motor.  Strange coincidence probably.   

[Ron Rich]

Steve,
I assumed not--however, I have been tolt many times, in my long life, not to ASSUME nothing ! And, believe me, I have seen many things done t these boxes that are worse then that ! So--I'm guessing (NOT assuming), that the buzz is caused by your low voltage situation, and that it will dis-appear when that is corrected. BTW--What does the printed coin info say on the glass installed in that SOM --one quarter per album side, or two quarters per album ? Ron Rich

[sooner]

Actually all of the electromagnets buzz now. It's just that the one that runs during the album cycle stays on most of the cycle so it's much more noticeable. It seems to come and go so hopefully it will go away with a proper power supply.

Glad you asked about the coins required. It's supposed to require a dime or two nickels for one selection or a quarter for 3 selections according to the inserts in the selection list that you flip through. There's nothing about albums. The glass insert that light up say "select any single" on the left and "or select any album" on the right.

I've been playing with the price adjustments trying to get them to agree with what's listed (two nickels or a dime for a single selection, and a quarter for either an album or 3 singles). It's working more or less with a couple of "glitches". It's giving a single for two nickels only after selecting an album. After selecting a single it only requires one nickel. Also, 2 dimes will get 3 singles or an album. I'm not sure how critical it really is since I don't have a slug rejecter anyway and will have to set it up for free play in some fashion if I get an emulator for it.

I did manage to get the APU unit removed and think I can get some oil to the back side of the motor and grease on the mechanisms now. I ran out of 3-in-One motor oil so need to get some new. The drop or two remaining in my very old can seemed a lot thicker than what I remembered so maybe new oil will help too.

Back to the transformer for a power supply. Does it need to be 75 watts or will 50 be enough?

Thanks,
Steve

[Ron Rich]

Steve,
You have the early version pricing set-up. Pricing was changed, and a kit was available to up-date older units. I see the glass, and the slide-in black plastic strips for sale, almost constantly on ePay-- As for the nickel, in order for that to operate properly, you need to install a "slug rejector", that is equipped with a "nickel diverter", so that ever-other nickel, triggers the dime credit coil. As for the transformer, Seeburg supplied one that was able to support 6 SC's on one line-- I don't know what the wattage was-- If you contact "Mr. Grumpy" as above, he sells one that is perfect for the job--I believe he tells about it on his site. Ron Rich

[robnyc]

Something such as this: www.amazon.com/Class-Transformer-75VA-120VAC-24VAC/dp/B008HOVEGU#feature-bullets-btf Bear in-mind it is from China.
Since nearly all od electro-mechanical boxes used similar voltage you can go outside of Seeburg. Rowe-Ami will be about 3 volts higher, but no real problem. if you have any operators or vendors in your area, why not ask if they have a tran. There was also a tran Seeburg used for either the dollar bill validators or some other device that will be fine too (I'm using one on location. You'll need to add terminals in place of the load side plug. RobNYC

[Ron Rich]

Seeburg's DBV transformers are perfect--just add a 4 pin A-MP plug to fit it--same transformer--

[sooner]

Well this has been a learning experience so far! I managed to get everything lubricated that I could get to without drilling any holes in the gear case. That worked. It now cycles fine on both single and album cycles. Cool! Turns out the only difference between the album and single cycles is that for albums the electromagnet engages a lever that reduces the remaining pay credit to zero. So rather than requiring more torque from the motor, the album cycle requires more current from the power supply.



I'm not sure the electromagnet was even engaging the lever during the album cycle before which is why I didn't notice it buzzing. I also discovered that the electromagnets operate on AC voltage. I didn't even know that was possible until researching on Google. I notice if I press the lever against the electromagnet during the album cycle the buzzing goes away. I'm hoping with a better power supply the electromagnet will pull harder on the lever and reduce the buzzing. I also learned that AC electromagnets tend to buzz more than ones that run on DC anyway so it's not uncommon.



As for the pricing, I also noticed another discrepancy. The window that lights up when a with quarter or 2 dimes says "2 singles or one album side" for a quarter where the slide-in plastic tabs say "3 singles" for a quarter. Another interesting thing is that while it is set up for 20 album sides and 140 singles, what's listed in the index are 4 album sides and 156 singles.



I found on "Mr. Grumpy's" site where he recommended a Jasmeco 28V 2A transformer. I just ordered one from them but got the 24V instead thinking my light bulbs may last a little longer with the lower voltage. I also cobbled together my 20 ohm resistor so I ordered a couple of proper ones too. Attached are some pics of my improvised power supply and resistor that you might get a kick out of...



Anyway, things are looking good. Now back to working on cosmetic stuff and pondering what to do for an mp3 emulator. Since I don't have a slug rejecter or coin box I have a lot of room inside to work with. Ideally I'd like to make it a stand alone unit with just a 120V power cord coming out.

[Ron Rich]

Sooner,
OMG-- what a "contraption"--lol
Find out what Mr Grumpy has for that wallbox--his is stand-alone-- and will fit into the cabinet WITH a slug rejector installed. Ron Rich

[sooner]

Yeah, My resistors were like my power supply. The total resistance was correct (20 ohms) but the power rating was a little low. They both served their purpose though.

I've already ordered a cheap emulator off eBay. I looked at what Mr Grumpy had but didn't see anything with a built-in amplifier. Would be nice to have it work with coins but then I would need to also buy a slug rejecter and coin box and I'm pretty sure doing that would mean the power transformer(s) would have to be outside of the wall box. Not to mention I just got an estimate to re-chrome the case so trying to keep the cost down on my "bargain" juke box...

I'll update as the project progresses. Many thanks for the help!

[sooner]

Just received my new transformer and tested it out. Works great. Idle voltage is 27v and drops to 25v under load. The light dims slightly during the cycle but barely noticeable and there's no buzzing from the electromagnets! And it's small enough to fit inside the coin box area too.
  I'm a happy camper! 


If anyone's interested here's the link where I got it.



www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10001&freeText=112513&langId=-1&storeId=10001&productId=112513

[Ron Rich]

Hi Steve,
Yep--Jamco people are the best--I am there, with my dog in tow, quite often, getting one thing or, another--about 20 minutes away from my place -- Figured that would work for you ! Ron Rich

[sooner]

Feb 22, 2019 18:56:24 GMT Ron Rich said:

Hi Steve,
Yep--Jamco people are the best--I am there, with my dog in tow, quite often, getting one thing or, another--about 20 minutes away from my place -- Figured that would work for you ! Ron Rich

I wish I had something local. I hate that Radio Shack went out of business. 

[Ron Rich]

Steve,
Look around locally--you would be surprised at the number on "Mom-Pop, electronic stores" left-- I have Jamco and another much smaller retail location, just about across the street from Jamco. Ron Rich